Jack Abbott MP: speeches

Speeches

• 7 May 2025 · Engagements · Hansard source

  More

  Q4. I refer the House to my declaration in the Register of Members’ Financial Interests. For young people in Ipswich, there is no shortage of ambition, just a need for greater opportunities. That is why last autumn I was proud to sign an agreement with Sizewell C to guarantee 500 jobs for people in my town, alongside additional investment for Suffolk New college’s courses on welding, engineering and fabrication, so that kids in my town can access the well-paid, secure, skilled jobs on offer. May I therefore urge the Prime Minister to support a final investment decision for Sizewell C, not just for our country’s energy security, but for the once-in-a-generation opportunities for young people in Ipswich and Suffolk?

• 2 Apr 2025 · Engagements · Hansard source

  More

  Q10. Stone Lodge academy, a special school in Ipswich, will be one of the first schools in the country to benefit from a new breakfast club this month. That is an important step in tackling Suffolk’s decades-long special educational needs and disabilities crisis, as is the multimillion-pound funding settlement given to opening new specialist places across the county. Will the Prime Minister outline what steps he will be taking to break down the barriers to opportunity further for all children as part of our plan for change?

• 25 Mar 2025 · Terminally Ill Adults (End of Life) Bill (Twenty-ninth sitting) · Hansard source

  More

  At this point, I pay tribute to my hon. Friends the Members for Penistone and Stocksbridge and for Bexleyheath and Crayford. They have consistently tabled really important amendments that are very close to my heart, measurably improving the Bill. I am briefly speaking in favour of new clause 35. We have had a number of good amendments about ensuring proper representation for vulnerable people during the process. We have also had a lot of discussion about the very important need to regularly monitor and report back on the Bill. This new clause brings all this together, ensuring that there is real oversight, with real thrust and a point to it. It is not good enough just to report back some statistics; the question is what we do with them. Having this sort of panel, with expertise and life experience, would be a significant step forward for people with disabilities, learning needs and anything else that might be included. Once again, I pay tribute to my hon. Friends for this work. I am fully supportive of the new clause.

• 25 Mar 2025 · Terminally Ill Adults (End of Life) Bill (Twenty-ninth sitting) · Hansard source

  More

  I appreciate the points made by the Minister and by my hon. Friend the Member for Spen Valley. “Family member” is a relatively non-specific description, but I think the thrust of the new clause is clear. Clearly, it is directed particularly at couples. I fully understand why my hon. Friend does not want people to have to go through a huge number of extra layers; I have said at length several times that I do not want people at the end of their life to go through an awful period of sitting in endless meetings, assessments or courtrooms. However, I reiterate that although they would be relatively exceptional, there will be situations in which coercion and other sorts of pressure are potentially at play. I agree that that may be an incredibly rare scenario and that two people may just want to go through the stages towards the end of life together, but extra checks may need to happen at some point to ensure absolutely that there is nothing untoward such as other sorts of pressure or coercion, rare as that might be.

• 25 Mar 2025 · Terminally Ill Adults (End of Life) Bill (Twenty-ninth sitting) · Hansard source

  More

  I beg to move, That the clause be read a Second time. I am minded not to press the new clause to a vote, but I have a few brief remarks to make. The new clause does what it says on the tin. It applies to the rare—I underline the word “rare”—cases in which two family members, particularly a couple, both receive a terminal diagnosis within a relatively short space of time and would therefore qualify under the Bill. For very many couples, there would be absolutely nothing untoward. Many people will make a decision in their best interests, particularly if they have been married or partners for a significant period. The new clause stipulates that if any medical or healthcare professional receives any indication that a patient is seeking an assisted death at the same time as one of their family members, especially a partner, both the co-ordinating doctor and a registered medical practitioner from the person’s GP practice must be notified and the patient must be referred both for a psychiatric assessment and for an assessment by a social worker. The assessing doctor would then have to take into account any opinion provided by the psychiatrist and social worker and share it with the assessing doctor. I appreciate that the new clause may be a little too prescriptive at this stage, but I would like the matter to be considered on Report and to be given further deliberation by the Government if the Act is passed and goes into the implementation phase. I think all Committee members can appreciate why such a scenario, rare as it may be, needs to be considered for the reasons we have discussed today in relation to coercion or other sorts of abuse, whether it is obvious or more pernicious. We know that in certain situations there will be people, particularly if they are married or in a long-term partnership, for whom such aspects may be at play. I am sure that they are a rare minority of cases, but I hope that these things are considered. Greater scrutiny is probably needed in these scenarios. Essentially, the new clause would allow for a more comprehensive and thorough assessment of people’s wellbeing and social context, including their relationship. I am not minded to press it to a vote at this stage.

• 19 Mar 2025 · Terminally Ill Adults (End of Life) Bill (Twenty-seventh sitting) · Hansard source

  More

  We all know that inequitable access to good quality health and palliative care is a massive issue across the country. People in certain communities—for example, those living in areas of high deprivation, those from black, Asian and minority ethnic communities and those from inclusion health groups, such as the homeless—already experience significant challenges in accessing quality care. We have a duty to ensure that anyone meeting the eligibility criteria who wishes to seek an assisted death under the Bill can do so. We must therefore ensure that the requirements for which forms of proof of identity are acceptable do not exacerbate existing inequalities of access and prevent those who would otherwise meet the eligibility criteria from seeking an assisted death should they choose to. The question of which forms of proof of identity are acceptable is therefore essential, as we know that photo ID requirements can present additional barriers to certain demographics and communities. Data from the Electoral Commission following the 2023 local elections found that while only 3% of all non-voters said that they did not vote because they did not have the required ID, that figure was 8% for unemployed non-voters and 9% for disabled non-voters who reported being “limited a lot” by their disability or health condition. The data also found that awareness of ID requirements was lower among those without an accepted form of ID—only 74%, in contrast with 92% of the population overall. Awareness of the requirement was also lower among young people and those from black and ethnic minority communities. Clearly, a photo ID requirement could present barriers to equitable access to assisted dying. We must ensure that requirements about which forms of proof of identity are acceptable do not create new inequalities of access. The requirement for proof of identity has been included in the Bill for a good reason, because it is a necessity and a critical safeguard. Ensuring that the Bill has the requisite safeguards for assisted dying to be safely implemented is essential to what the Committee is doing. It is therefore important to get right the question of what forms of proof of identity are acceptable for someone to access assisted dying under the Bill. We must also ensure equity of access to the service without diluting critical safeguards. Clause 6 says that the regulations regarding the forms of proof of identity that are acceptable are subject to the negative procedure, but the issue is too important to be left to that negative procedure without sufficient parliamentary scrutiny. By including the requirements for which forms of proof of identity are acceptable in clause 30, the amendment would rectify that. It would entail that the regulations pertaining to which forms of proof of identity are acceptable under clause 6 are subject to the affirmative procedure and that, prior to the Secretary of State issuing a code of practice in relation to the question, they would have to consult such persons as they considered appropriate. By agreeing the amendment, we would guarantee that the question of which forms of proof of identity are acceptable is given the requisite consideration. That would ensure that the requirements do not act as a barrier to equitable access to assisted dying, without diluting the safeguards that the requirement inserts into the Bill.

• 19 Mar 2025 · Terminally Ill Adults (End of Life) Bill (Twenty-seventh sitting) · Hansard source

  More

  I realise that we could be called away to vote at any moment, but I rise to speak to amendment 534. It is relatively small, and I appreciate that what it seeks may already be covered by regulations, but it would ensure that it is also put in a code of practice. Anybody seeking an assisted death under the Bill who meets the eligibility criteria should be able to access it. However, there is a risk that the requirement that patients provide two forms of proof of identification could present challenges for certain groups, causing inequalities of access— [ Interruption. ]

• 19 Mar 2025 · Terminally Ill Adults (End of Life) Bill (Twenty-seventh sitting) · Hansard source

  More

  It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mrs Harris. I was not planning to speak on this group either, but the debate speaks to a number of the things that we have talked about in the past few weeks. I add the caveat that all hon. Members present acknowledge that the promoter of the Bill, my hon. Friend the Member for Spen Valley, has repeatedly made it clear that data collection is essential to what we are proposing. I am also sympathetic to what my hon. Friend the Member for Sunderland Central said about not necessarily needing to put everything in the Bill. Without trying to sound like a broken record, however—I have made this point several times over the past few weeks—it is critical that in certain situations, although there may be some regulations or inferences that exist that may lead to certain outcomes that we on this Committee would all like to see, there is nothing necessarily wrong with putting them explicitly in writing. Hon. Members have used different stats from different jurisdictions in their own way to lend weight to their arguments, and although many of those stats are relatively consistent in a number of areas, they are not necessarily decisive. I cited a stat yesterday when speaking to an amendment that around 10% of people using the assisted dying route have complications during the final stages, but as I said then, that came from an incredibly small sample size of just over 100 people. It is therefore critical that, if the Bill is passed and we go down this path, we pursue robust and expansive data gathering in a number of different areas, and I am sure that any Government would look to do so. As long as it does not create any loopholes or unintended consequences, that sort of evidence gathering should be in the Bill because, at the very least, that would provide reassurance that it will happen if the Bill is passed.

• 19 Mar 2025 · Terminally Ill Adults (End of Life) Bill (Twenty-sixth sitting) · Hansard source

  More

  Another example raised by the hon. Member for East Wiltshire was about hospitals under certain trusts—because of the word “premises”. In the Government’s view, would hospitals and other such facilities beyond hospices and care homes also be included within this new clause?

• 19 Mar 2025 · Terminally Ill Adults (End of Life) Bill (Twenty-sixth sitting) · Hansard source

  More

  I appreciate that, but as my hon. Friend has said a number of times over the last few weeks, some of these things unfortunately do happen. As I am sure we all do, I have had casework involving people with guide dogs saying that they have been refused certain services, including taxis, even though that is a civil offence because they have a guide dog with them. We have said a number of times that there are flaws in every single system. I appreciate that we want to adopt a good-will attitude, and I am sure the vast majority of settings across the country will operate on that basis, but we know that, in certain circumstances, that is not always the case. That is why, if we put anything in the Bill, it needs to have real clarity and not unintended consequences.

• 19 Mar 2025 · Terminally Ill Adults (End of Life) Bill (Twenty-sixth sitting) · Hansard source

  More

  A lot of the focus in the last few minutes has been about a care home having already made it clear that it does not support the process of assisted dying and the fact that anyone entering it would therefore know that. However, there is a clear scenario where some care homes might change their position over time. Someone may be in a care home for many years, but then the care home might change its position and say, “Actually, now we do not support assisted dying.” In that scenario, people would actually have gone into that setting thinking that it supported assisted dying. Although I am sympathetic to the issue of place being made clear, it has real ramifications. Again, I do not think it is as black and white as saying, “This care home already had a set position.” Some care homes or other settings might change their position over time, even when residents are in situ for a long time. That is the big problem with this particular clause: the situation is not as straightforward as some Members have perhaps suggested today.

• 19 Mar 2025 · Terminally Ill Adults (End of Life) Bill (Twenty-sixth sitting) · Hansard source

  More

  I do not want to go over ground that we covered in the later hours of yesterday, but this is sort of the issue that my amendment 533 sought to resolve, albeit via regulations rather than in the Bill directly. I am sure that our colleagues on the Front Bench will be doing some thinking about it. As the hon. Member for East Wiltshire alluded to, in some situations the question of place—of where we will be able to carry out these procedures—is not black and white. I fully appreciate what my hon. Friend is saying, which is that if someone chooses to end their own life in their own home, they should be able to do so. In some cases, however, the Government will need to give further thought to the issue of place. I think that is really important.

• 18 Mar 2025 · Terminally Ill Adults (End of Life) Bill (Twenty-fifth sitting) · Hansard source

  More

  Absolutely, I know. I am sure the Committee supports him as well. I would also point the hon. Gentleman to proposed new subsection (13), which my amendment 532 would introduce, saying what “specific actions” can legally be taken, for example, if “there is a greatly prolonged time to death”, the person has been “rendered unconscious” or “the person is otherwise undergoing complications.” That quite clearly states that we expect the Secretary of State, through this amendment, to take specific co-ordination actions on that. Under proposed new subsection (12) alone, the Secretary of State would have to make provision on that, which could lead to what the hon. Gentleman is alluding to. However, what I propose in proposed new subsection is very clear: that we would expect specific actions from the Secretary of State in that area.

• 18 Mar 2025 · Terminally Ill Adults (End of Life) Bill (Twenty-fifth sitting) · Hansard source

  More

  I fully accept my hon. Friend’s points, and I agree. To reiterate, complications are not a regular occurrence by any means. They are relatively uncommon. In saying that, there are still 10% of people who did experience them. As she says, these complications are not huge, but there were issues with being able to ingest the substance or with regurgitating it. The figure of 86% that my hon. Friend refers to is absolutely correct, but that would suggest that for 14% of people it took longer than an hour. In my view, that is a relatively high percentage for what we are talking about here. As I say, my amendment does not seek to stipulate in the Bill exactly what measures have to be taken in every single scenario. I am not suggesting for a moment that we have to legislate about what we must do in the event that, for instance, someone has difficulty ingesting the substance; I am sure that will come naturally with the GMC regulations. I fully appreciate the points made about how this will probably naturally occur, but it is important to provide a reassurance that we are looking at the long-term effects in such scenarios.

• 18 Mar 2025 · Terminally Ill Adults (End of Life) Bill (Twenty-fifth sitting) · Hansard source

  More

  I was just finishing, but the hon. Gentleman has timed it perfectly, so I will.

• 18 Mar 2025 · Terminally Ill Adults (End of Life) Bill (Twenty-fifth sitting) · Hansard source

  More

  I thank my hon. Friend for the question; I agree that 10% is a statistically reasonable figure and should be noted, which is part of the reason for my amendment. However, this is still relatively uncommon from the small sample sizes we have. For example, while it is important to refer to the Oregon example, the sample size is only 100 people, so we should always keep that in context. Will fewer people choose to go down that path because they feel, for example, there is potentially a small chance they might struggle to ingest the substance? To be perfectly honest with my hon. Friend, that will completely be their personal choice, and it is really important that, in every stage of the process, we are very clear with those looking to go down this path about what those eventualities might be. Everyone will take their own personal opinion about that, but we want to be very clear about any risks that might come about, and we have already stipulated that this will be part of the process. Everyone should be very clear about the process—what it will look like and the associated risks. Many people will look at this and still say, “This is the path for me”, but that of course will be their own judgment.

• 18 Mar 2025 · Terminally Ill Adults (End of Life) Bill (Twenty-fifth sitting) · Hansard source

  More

  I appreciate my hon. Friend giving way again. For people in the Committee and our colleagues across the House, there has to be clarity. Perhaps it is a question for the Bill promoter’s and the Government. As I said, I have no personal problem with it, but is there an expectation that assisted dying will take place at home as well as in medical facilities?

• 18 Mar 2025 · Terminally Ill Adults (End of Life) Bill (Twenty-fifth sitting) · Hansard source

  More

  I appreciate that point. Throughout this process we have spoken about the absolute need to ensure that very good palliative care options are being presented to everybody along this pathway. I do not think you can separate care homes and hospices from the Bill, but I fully appreciate and sympathise with what the hon. Gentleman is saying. As I have said, there may be some hospices that are simply not appropriate for this, so although amendment 533 does not seek to put that on the face of the Bill in terms of precluding any particular areas of our healthcare system, it would require the Secretary of State, through consultation, to make sure that the legislation is used properly, and make suitable recommendations.

• 18 Mar 2025 · Terminally Ill Adults (End of Life) Bill (Twenty-fifth sitting) · Hansard source

  More

  I fully understand and am very sympathetic to my hon. Friend’s point about the family having privacy and space in the last moments. However—this is a genuine question—what happens if things start to go wrong? Although it is uncommon, we know it is possible. Do we expect the family members who are going through the last traumatic moments to have to go out of the room to find the doctor, albeit they might just be behind the door? I do not know that that would necessarily make it less traumatic, and for some people it could make it worse if the doctor is not there and present next to their bed.

• 18 Mar 2025 · Terminally Ill Adults (End of Life) Bill (Twenty-fifth sitting) · Hansard source

  More

  I appreciate what my hon. Friend is saying about the Secretary of State not stipulating every dot of every i and cross of every t in the regulations, but we are talking about something that has not been practised in this country, so we do not have existing guidance anywhere about what to do in this event. My hon. Friend may correct me, but I think it is really important that the Secretary of State has to give some direction through regulations on what a doctor is able or not able to do in these situations. I appreciate that there must remain room for a doctor’s best-case judgment in certain situations but, from a legal perspective and otherwise, the Secretary of State and the Department will have to give some thought to exactly how the regulations work.

• 18 Mar 2025 · Terminally Ill Adults (End of Life) Bill (Twenty-fifth sitting) · Hansard source

  More

  No, is the short answer to that question. Because a doctor has to be present, are we saying that doctors have to go to someone’s home to administer this? Would the Secretary State say, for example—this is not my personal view; it is for discussion—that it would have to take place in a medical facility, or could people choose to have an assisted death at home? The amendment stipulates that the Secretary of State would have to give that guidance at the time. I do not see how we can have doctors going out to individuals’ homes to assist the process.

• 18 Mar 2025 · Terminally Ill Adults (End of Life) Bill (Twenty-fifth sitting) · Hansard source

  More

  This issue came up in the oral evidence sessions. Assisted dying has not been introduced in this country, but very few people would say that palliative care has improved in the 10 years since the House last voted on assisted dying. As I said in the oral evidence sessions, I am not sure that that comparison is directly relevant to what we are debating.

• 18 Mar 2025 · Terminally Ill Adults (End of Life) Bill (Twenty-fifth sitting) · Hansard source

  More

  I appreciate the point that the hon. Gentleman is trying to make. We have discussed this point at length, across a range of subject areas, but we cannot legislate for every single permutation that could possibly happen. That could be about the initial conversations, when the patient is given a terminal diagnosis. Where do those conversations leave us? Clearly there will be a number of different scenarios, which could occur to various degrees. I do not think it is possible to legislate for every single eventuality. I do not believe that whether to revive or not revive will be so black and white; it will completely depend on the scenario at that particular moment in time. Therefore, further work would need to be done over the coming months and years before the final introduction of the Bill. I believe that it is important to allow the time for that work to happen alongside the existing guidance as it stands. I do not seek in my amendment to stipulate exactly what every single permutation might be—indeed, that could run to many pages and beyond. The amendment seeks to empower the Secretary of State and the Department to make sure that those eventualities, and the concerns that the hon. Member for East Wiltshire has raised, are covered by regulations over time. In my view, the failure to provide a clear answer to these questions is an oversight. Data from Oregon shows that it is unfortunately not totally uncommon for patients to suffer complications following the administration of a lethal substance. In 2023, of the 102 patients for whom we have data on whether they suffered complications—out of a total of 367 patients who died by assisted death in Oregon in that year—10 suffered complications. That is just under 10% of the patients we have data for. Of those 10, eight had difficulty ingesting the substance or regurgitated it. One suffered a seizure, and for one we have no data of what complications occurred. If I may say so to the hon. Member for East Wiltshire, that goes back to the variances that I referred to. It is not as simple as whether to resuscitate or otherwise. There are a number of different factors. Although that is a relatively small sample size, it shows the diversity of the challenges ahead. In Oregon, information about complications is reported only when a physician or another healthcare provider is present at the time of death, which means that we evidently have less data on this issue than is desirable. However, despite the small sample size, that data would put the complication rate at one in 10. It would not be a completely uncommon occurrence for patients to experience complications following the administration of a lethal substance, although it would be rare.

• 18 Mar 2025 · Terminally Ill Adults (End of Life) Bill (Twenty-fifth sitting) · Hansard source

  More

  I appreciate what my hon. Friend is getting at in terms of what might happen down the line, but the amendment would not restrict any doctor’s flexibility at all or bind them in any way. All it would do is ask the Secretary of State to form a set of regulations.

• 18 Mar 2025 · Terminally Ill Adults (End of Life) Bill (Twenty-fifth sitting) · Hansard source

  More

  I rise to speak to amendments 532 and 533, standing in my name, and in support of amendments 429 and 430, tabled by my hon. Friend the Member for Bexleyheath and Crayford. I appreciate that my amendments are similar to amendment 430. They go a little bit further, but probably not as far as we have previously discussed in the Committee. I totally understand the concerns about the Bill being overly prescriptive about the regulations that could be passed down to the doctors making such decisions. However, it is important that we enable the Secretary of State to provide guidance, in addition to GMC regulations, on what the co-ordinating doctor must do if the procedure has failed. At the moment, the Bill simply states: “The coordinating doctor must remain with the person until” that time. However, I appreciate that amendment 429, if passed, would cover that issue. Clause 9 states: “The assessing doctor must…discuss with the person their wishes in the event of complications arising in connection with the self-administration of an approved substance under section 18”. However, the Bill as drafted is not clear about what a doctor is legally permitted to do in the event of such complications. That is particularly important, as the Bill expressly states that the final act of administration must be taken by the person themselves. Therefore, the Bill as it stands stipulates that the doctor must discuss the patient’s wishes in the event of complications without stipulating what actions the doctor can take in such an event and thus what the patient’s options actually are. There is a gap in the Bill and a lack of clarity on that critical issue, which has been raised frequently in both written and, to an extent, oral evidence. Dr Alexandra Mullock argued that, as “the Bill would only permit” a doctor only to assist in the patient’s self-administering a substance, “administering drugs to end the life of a patient who might be unconscious (but not dying) is not permitted.” She also raised the possibility that a patient might regain consciousness, but “be too ill to make a second attempt” at self-administration. What should a doctor do if that occurs? Unless the Secretary of State clarifies what a doctor can do in that situation—my amendment would not do that; it would merely give the Secretary of State direction to do so—the co-ordinating director could be placed in a difficult position. Professor Alex Ruck Keene argued that the Bill as it stands could lead to the potential for medical professionals to be “required to stand by”, yet without being able to take steps to respond to complications so as to ensure that the process is completed. I fully appreciate that all doctors would use their good training, common sense and years of extensive practice to make a best-case judgment, and we would always support them in that, but the Bill has the unintended consequence of not giving doctors true cover in that area. Dr Mullock also asked what should occur if the patient survives a procedure, “but is badly affected”. What treatment should be provided? Should the patient be moved to hospital? Should the patient be sedated or made comfortable until a natural death occurs, or should the doctor be able to take steps for the patient to die following the initial failed attempt? We need answers to those questions. Amendment 532 does not seek to answer them, but it would stipulate that the Secretary of State must do so at a certain point.